How customer-centred design can be a recipe for your most poignant customer insights. Episode 2 features an in-depth and delicious chat with Bianca DiPietro, Design & Creative Lead at Hello Fresh. Like millions of people, you might enjoy these meal kits on the weekly, but what you might not know is how Hello Fresh leverages design thinking and customer testing to push their market hold open. The guys explore scaling, sustainability, challenging the status quo when it comes to supply chain, and disrupting entrenched markets through deep customer insights. Kyle and Tom also uncover some of Bianca’s secret ingredients for turning growing customer expectations into customer delight.

Learn more about our guest:

Bianca DiPietro, Design & Creative Lead at Hello Fresh

Transcript

Tom:
Welcome to commerce chefs, a quirky and thought provoking show for future focused commerce leaders. We're gonna pit the world's most brilliant, inspiring, and driven D2C visionaries. The commerce chefs with riveting questions to uncover their secret ingredients at the intersection of passion, performance, and leadership and practice

Kyle:
For the past decade, we've led teams of designers, strategists, and digital wizards at one of the leading E eCom agencies in the country to help brave brands become enduring classics,

Tom:
And we're here to indefinitely borrow the strategies and pro tips that will make us all better leaders and make the brands we lead better too. Hey Kyle, what you doing?

Kyle:
Just cooking up some sweet, sweet food for our guests today.

Tom:
Oh, that's very thoughtful. You know that we're not chatting in person though, right?

Kyle:
No, I did not know that. Well, what am I gonna do with all the scrumptious food that have worked on all day?

Tom:
I just see a bunch of PB and J sandwiches.

Kyle:
Yeah.

Tom:
Oh, oh, okay. Okay then. Well, I mean, you can count me in for at least two or three of those. I am hungry and I'm jazzed about our episode today. We are literally going to jump into the e-comm kitchen of one of the most impactful and growing food brands in the market today.

Kyle:
Ooh, now I'm hungry. Yeah. Hungry to learn more, more about scaling sustainability supply chain, disrupting entrenched markets through deep customer insights.

Tom:
And to explore just that we are riffing with Bianca DPA, aro the design and creative lead at hello fresh. We look through the lens of design thinking and customer testing and uncover the secret ingredients for turning growing customer expectations into customer D delight,

Kyle:
Delicious. Hello, fresh.

Tom:
We have our good friend Bianca here today to chat with us about something that I think everybody will find tasty and delicious Bianca. Hello, welcome to commerce chefs. Why don't you introduce yourself to our listeners? Give us a bit of background on who you are, where you work, what you do, and then we've got some pretty riveting questions for you.

Bianca:
Hi everybody. Hi Kyle. Hi Tom.

Tom:
Hi Bianca.

Bianca:
Thank you for having me. I'm so excited about this. Just to start off there. So a little bit about myself. So as you probably all know my name's Bianca, I am currently the creative lead of hello, fresh Canada. If you don't know what hella fresh is, it's a meal kit delivery service. So I am the creative lead as of January, 2022 and congrat yeah, that's my, my current role. I I'm a designer been designing for over 10 years and before hello, fresh. I was actually in education for six years. So I was educating the future designers who hopefully I will be hiring as part of my team one day. I think it's kind of determined my pathway in terms of like doing design, doing, doing coding. Then I've taught now I'm back and I'm actually leading a team which is really exciting and is really fresh. Yeah, you made it three minutes. That's my <laugh>, I'm very new to the full time role at hello, fresh, but I actually freelanced for hello fresh before being full time. So that was kind of my in and how I got to know the team before actually starting full time. So that's an kind of a cool story as well, just to a side note to my, how I got here. Yeah. I think that kind of in a nutshell defines where, what I'm doing, who I am and all that, that fun stuff.

Tom:
It is fun. And I appreciate that you used fresh so soon. Mind you, I think for, for Kyle and I, that that takes that pun off the table really early, but I, I think we'll get over that does yeah,

Kyle:
I'm a little confused what to do now with the rest of this interview, just

Tom:
Scrap, scrap, the script cry. It's overcount everything

Kyle:
Is out now. <Laugh>

Tom:
<Laugh> Bianca, thanks for sharing that. I, I won't speak for Kyle here and, and his, you know, food choices, but I'm, I'm proud to say that for the last three years, I have been part of the fresh fam with my family and I've loved, loved it for a number of reasons, but yeah, just wanted to plug that there because I think it's important to, to let you know that I'm on the right team.

Bianca:
Amazing. I'm glad you're part of the fresh fam.

Tom:
Is that what it's called?

Bianca:
Yes. Every time, every time a friend texts me and they're like, Hey, I'm trying hella fresh. I respond back. Welcome to the fresh fan. It's a thing.

Tom:
Contractually obligated discount

Kyle:
Code, fresh fan, a checkout.

Tom:
<Laugh> everybody

Bianca:
Gets, might work,

Tom:
Try out. I have it doesn't work. Oh, no, that's great. Yeah. So I think, you know, we were chatting a little bit before being like, Hey, come, come talk to us. And, and I just, I thought you had such a really cool, fresh perspective no pun intended emphasis intended on kind of yeah. Like how, how design plays into this space. Like obviously, you know, with, with PB and J I mean our, our focus and our love and our passion is with direct to consumer eCommerce, you know, which cello fresh really falls into outside, you know, over and above that tech component that you certainly are working on quite consistently, but I just loved that idea coming back to our design roots, you know, to be able to speak with somebody from a design standpoint and how design plays a role in a business that is so contingent on retention and, and lifetime value and multichannel and sort of all the, the things that go into something like hello, fresh scaling.

Tom:
So I appreciate you coming to speak with us today about what that role or how that role plays into your, your work hello, fresh, and then certainly the, the story of hello, fresh overall, cuz it's certainly something that I think most people know about or, or should. So Kyle let's, let's dive in here, Bianca, talk to us a little bit about how, you know, in, in the time that you've been with hello fresh, how has, how has design played a role in conversations or, or execution, you know, practically speaking in, you know, these kind of three core areas around eCommerce, which are attraction, conversion and retention.

Bianca:
In my role as a creative lead, focusing on the design, as, you know, design has the power to share basically the hello of fresh story with our customers. So it's basically our main driver on how we continue to scale at hello, fresh in the Canadian market, just to give the, the audience some context, hello, fresh launched in Germany in 2011 or started, I should say, as an idea in 2011 and has scaled to 16 different markets globally in 10 years. So that's the level of scaling that's happened. And I think what design has been able to for hello fresh is basically drive that scaling by telling our story. So design is, is storytelling. It's, you know, it's convincing and telling and teaching our customers that there's an easier, more convenient way to get your groceries, get meals prepared and have a sit down dinner time meal than the traditional way of doing things.

Bianca:
So the strategy of design at hello fresh is always to really increase product consideration because we're actually still a very new business model. You know, like not a lot of people still fully actually understand how a meal kit service can actually benefit them. So we have to through design and messaging and storytelling have to tell this story to our new potential customers and also continue to tell the story and, and a better story to our customers that are with us and our messaging and VI visual show people how and why our service works so well and how it can fit into their basically their mealtime routine. So we have BR brand campaigns to highlight all of these, all of the, sort of the hello, fresh brand pillars I would call them. So we have like B product marketing, sustainability, our convenience, and like our design and what we execute in terms of like advertising and campaigns and, and, and different messaging out to the public is focused on those brand pillars, but also telling our story in a way that's digestible and appetizing.

Bianca:
So we are inundated with so much these days, so many new products, so many new, new ways of doing things. And so the, the, the challenge from a design perspective is also doing this in a way that resonates with new customers, customers who are convinced that their traditional way of, you know, making a home cooked meal is the way is not changeable. You can't, you can't disrupt that. Or that's just the way it works. We have to convince them that no, hello, fresh is really convenient and it's exciting. It, you know, it makes joyous the mealtime experience again. So, ah, love that word. That's

Tom:
Joyous.

Bianca:
Yeah. That's the joyous that's share the joy. That's one of our real key messages at hell fresh is like, it doesn't need to be, you know, an unpleasant experience planning and cooking a meal. It can be enjoyable and

Tom:
Exciting. Yeah. The traditional approach that, that you're talking about is that like, you know, oh, I've, I've gotta make a grocery list. I then have to go to the grocery store. I have to walk around aimlessly on all of these aisles. I will probably buy cookies that I don't need. And this is speaking from experience or a friend of mine anyway, a friend, you know, and then, and so bringing all that back home, probably not following that meal plan, cuz something comes up, you know, making that food and then throwing away half the stuff you probably purchased in the first place is that, that sort of traditional approach to, to, to meal preparation that you're talking about.

Bianca:
Yes. So they at hello fresh, we call that the pull concept. So the idea of like you have to, you have to decide what you're gonna cook. You have to make a grocery list. You have to go to the grocery store, purchase the ingredients and then you can't purchase the exact amount of ingredients you usually need. So maybe some goes to waste and then you buy things that you may not use and you buy extra things like you're saying the cookies, like you may not need whole method is the hell of fresh way. So it is, you know, we know exactly how many customers are ordering our meals and re resource the ingredients, exactly how as we need, according to how many orders we have, and there's no waste, this will come through in more of the sustain if we chat about sustainability. But the idea that like the supply chain, the traditional supply chain is, has so many more steps.

Bianca:
Number one, number two, it has much more waste along those steps. And then truthfully at the end of the supply chain, some of the food doesn't even get bought and used. So it's quite the difference between the hello FRA supply chain and the traditional supply chain is quite different. And it's one of our biggest pushes this year in terms of like messaging that, you know, we're not, we're not only just increasing the exper the, you know, the joyous mealtime experience as well as creating, you know, some people are like, oh, I've, I've learnt to cook, you know, having hello fresh. And I've explored, you know, territories in, in tastes that I've never explored before. And there's all these other benefits, but yeah, it's the supply chain. The difference in terms of waste and carbon emissions is quite, it's quite dramatic.

Kyle:
Yeah. Is I know, I know we'll dive into that with sustainability. I'm curious as we're still kind of on this, the conversion attraction, conversion retention topic, if we could talk a little bit about commoditization and Bianca you're way closer to this, but if you're, if you're like me, I get about 1600 flyers a week from meal kit services. And I, and I can imagine a bit 10 years ago when hello, fresh was, was real word when it was inception, you know, it was the differentiator was probably the, the concept of all the things you're talking about. And I'm curious, I don't, has that been commoditized or is there like, and you, you need to differentiate with design or are you differentiating still with the process of what you go about the meal kit, even in a world where there's so many meal kits now

Bianca:
We're still like, we're still considered the number one meal kit in Canada. I mean, I think there, the they're like we do have a lot of competitors. I'm not gonna deny that. I think we still offer it's all the little things that add up. It's like, you know, we, people rave about our meals. They rave about our customer service. They rave about how, you know, we're always adding, we now have over 40 recipes to choose from every week. I believe. We have more product offerings. So we are expanding our cat diet categories, for example, like low calorie low carb. We are, you know, we have now have add-ons we have add-ons that you can add to what is really, I would say started as a dinner time solution is now you can get lunches, you can get appetizers, you can get breakfast.

Bianca:
There's all kinds of like we're continually adding. So the, the, the focus now is hell fresh. Doesn't just wanna be your meal kit solution. It wants to be your food solution. We want to continue to grow and be what our customers want us to be. So, and that's why we're always testing, right? We, we do, we do messaging and design and we send out, you know, you know, referrals and we're encouraging our customers to refer friends with, you know, you get a free, you get a free box and all this stuff, but it really comes down to once we have that customer it's, we are doing everything in our, in our capability to test and, you know, offer things. We have partnerships that we're doing where, you know, one week you open your box and you have, you know, samples of something in there. Yeah.

Bianca:
Like there's all kinds of small perks and benefits along the way that I think are just contributing to why it's Al like customers are just happy. We're always doing new things. We're always elevating and just listening to what, what our customers want. So really at the end of the day, it, I know design design tells a story, but our design is validated by, okay. Did, did our insert really, you know, up the retention that week, like, did our customers pause versus, you know, actually ordering, and this is all, this is all us listening to the customers and like figuring out what they like, what they want. And then we just, we, we make those adjustments and we make those pivots as, as we see the metrics, show up,

Kyle:
How much of that data do you I'm not sure what you can disclose, but like how much data do you use to influence your design, your brand work?

Bianca:
It's, it's always, it's a, it's a little bit of a, like a, a struggle to always know exactly what is, you know, design related versus maybe like messaging related versus discount related versus referral related. You know, there's all these different, we do try when we do sort of a test or a creative test to really like change one thing or two things. So we can really see, like, do customers want more referral options? Do they want to see our meals? Like the options for new meals on our creative? Do they want, like, just recently we had a really, really good, some really good metrics come back from a paid social campaign, a local one that really highlighted. We have now carb and local, low carb and local recipes, which is like, if you're a customer, you know that, but I think the ones we're trying to convince, like the brand consideration customers like, Hey, sign up for hello, fresh. We actually have a lot of options for you that really like, it went really well. So again, it's just like testing and understanding, you know? Yes, it's gotta be, it's gotta be to brand, but like, what is, what, like, what assets are we using? What imagery are we using? What are we highlighting? So a lot of the times we're still telling customers like who we are and what we do, because again, we're very new, right? Like we're still very new, fresh,

Tom:
Fresh is the term you're very fresh.

Bianca:
So yeah, we're very fresh, but I'm so sorry, you know, like that was a very, like, that was a sort of, I mean, it doesn't sound so risky, but it was a risky sort of paid campaign, more so focusing on, okay. Like maybe people know who we are, we need to drive more. So the, like, we actually have a lot of options for you choose us or choose us and we will continually add to our product offerings.

Tom:
Right. Well, I think we've, we've talked about this, I think on a number of occasions from a few angles, but, but two things that I love about that is just an approach to testing or AB testing essentially, is what are the things that resonate or connect with, or, you know, entice the people that we're trying to reach. And second is that you're just, you're listening. You're, you're trying to engage with and understand what's important for your customer base. You know, I, I think we believe that all brands need to be doing that more. And especially in this era moving forward and then into the next year or two, I mean, that's gonna be pretty critical to growth is, is just a passion for your customers and truly connecting there and having a long term perspective with retention and lifetime value. It isn't about that, that initial purchase or that cost per click.

Tom:
It is about how you can breathe value continually into somebody's life with, with what it is that you have to offer. So I'll say Bravo on those two pieces, but, but talk a little bit then about cuz this, this sort of pushes my mind to, especially over the pandemic, you know, the, the last two years have been, have been crazy on a number of fronts, but what, what are some of the things, and, and I know you haven't been there over the, the entire time, but what are some of the big shifts that you've seen where the hello fresh has seen in customer behavior and expectations over the last couple of years? So growth aside, how has the customer landscape expectations and behavior changed over the last two years? Well,

Bianca:
<Laugh> the pandemic <laugh> or the good old pandemic has played definitely a big role. And the thing that we see at hello fresh is like, I mean, this is not, I feel like anybody can, can almost say this, but it's like the pivoting of people's routines. And that like, that is just not in the food space. That is in all kinds of different ways of doing things. We've seen people's habits and routines, but they've been changed. So the idea of mealtime and dinner time at home is like a completely different thing now than it was before, because people are doing it more. You know, I think people are revisiting the idea of like, you know, sitting down having a home cooked meal, enjoying it with their, with their family. Mm. I think that's something that we really started to, you know, appreciate again in the pandemic.

Bianca:
And like, I know it's a result of the pandemic, but it's also pivoting just people's ideas around it. And I don't think that's just like going to go away after the pandemic. I think people are going to appreciate the learnings of like what happened right over the last two years. So following the first year of the pandemic we saw, I mean, overall just our consumers needed more convenience. So, you know, we're in the, I, you know, we're in lockdowns, we're in different types of situations where we, we don't have the full access to going out and maybe like getting exactly what we need all the time during the pandemic. So the convenience aspect to like dinner time was something that was like elevated like a lot during the, during the pandemic. And now we see that that is one of the driving pillars and continues to be the driving pillar of hello, fresh.

Tom:
That's so awesome. Yeah. Thanks for that insight. And, and you did touch on that sort of disruption piece, which I know is a big part of what hello, fresh is looking to do. And even some of the conversations that, that we've had Bianca around that of which, which to be, to be candid, I guess I didn't really think about, you know, even, even when we decided to sort of go the hello fresh route, it certainly was around convenience first. And then you sort of start to see all of these tertiary, well, secondary and tertiary benefits. And, you know, I, haven't had more dance parties in my kitchen than I have with, with hello, fresh. But you know, I think the, the underlying hero of the story is, is what you're touching on. And, and maybe it, I don't know in my mind, it, it should be one of the, you know, the key players is this sustainability, this, this grocery supply chain disruption, because there's, I think there's, there's no hiding the fact that food food is broken here in, in a lot of places.

Tom:
It is from, from our approach and understanding of, of nutrition to portion sizes, to, you know, what foods are, are even good for you or, or not how you purchase them, the waste that goes into it and accessibility and affordability. And I, I think, you know, at length that could be discussed, but that just seems to be something that, that is just really confident and strong in the underlying hello, fresh story. So it, Kyle, if you're good about it, cause I know you love, you love this, this part of the business, but it's, it's something we see being important across the board is sustainability is a holistic approach to the impact that not just a, a business or a brand has, but what that, what that entire vertical plays to in a, in a more global consideration. So yeah, let, let's, let's dive into that, that part of the, the story here, cause I know you've touched on it with, from supply chain to waste. This is a big part of what hello, fresh is looking at.

Bianca:
Yeah. Hello, fresh is like our, one of our biggest pushes is sustainability. We, it, it really, it, it comes down to a couple key key metrics that we like to tell our customers. And this is all available on our website too. Like we're very much we want, I mean, consideration is always convenience and quality, but like we want to tell our customers, like by doing this, you're doing good for, you know, food waste, cutting down carbon emissions, we're doing so many good things as well by choosing us as your food solutions. So hello, fresh as a business cuts down carbon emissions by one third compared to the traditional supply chain. So our facilities and our operations also generate 72% less food waste than traditional supply chains. 72%. It's huge. Like it's, that's wild. Wow. Yeah. It's like insanely huge the number and the difference it's because there is just so much like from the consumer side, once you buy your, your groceries from the grocery store, you only see your waste.

Bianca:
Mm-Hmm, <affirmative>, there's so much waste along the supply chain that is also considered with like the traditional. So like again, you like a lot of consumers only see what they see, right. But when you like boil it down to the whole supply chain, that's, that's what the number actually ends up being a 72% less. A lot of our focus is on like responsible consumption and production. So we support safe and sustainable food growing processing systems. We try to minimize food and packaging waste. We still have, we are still innovating and piloting all kinds of different materials, different products, different ways of actually reducing our packaging. Cause that's the, one of the most visible things that people tend to notice with. So like this box that comes to my door and everything's packaged and it's like, yeah, but the traditional supply chain also has, you know, boxing and packaging and all these different ways to keep the food from, you know, becoming moldy and all, all kinds of different things.

Bianca:
Right? So it's again, only what you see, but we do, we do quite good. We are, you know, continually, always trying to reduce the, the plastic where we can with, you know, dry ingredients and things like that. So we're always piloting new, new, new things, seeing if they work, because again, the sustainability pushes a big thing for hella fresh. We, we also focus on climate change and climate action. So all our operations are energy efficient. We're reducing greenhouse gases and whatever we can't reduce, we offset that can't be, be avoided. So, and we work with certified suppliers who use Marine sources and land-based ecosystems that are sustainable. So we also are sourcing our ingredients from like certified suppliers, which is one of our big pushes as well. And we're always tracking and reducing carbon emissions. So every year we have sort of a sustainability report that we put out it's publicly, publicly put out.

Bianca:
You can download it, read it. And we're always trying to achieve better and better every year. And that's again, by piloting more things, testing more things out, exploring, you know, new avenues, like for example this is just one thing that's top of mind for me, but like our frozen, you know, cooler packs that come in the boxes are now just water. So you just puncture the plastic pouch. You can water your plants with the water that's inside or whatever do you wanna do with the water inside? And then the actual plastic that is can like around the water is totally recyclable. So those packs that were before, like those, I don't even know what their what's in them, cuz I that's not my that's not my forte, but the gel ones that were like either, what do you do with them? You refreeze them, maybe use them later.

Bianca:
But then at the end of the day, you end up having so many of these gel packs, they are now water. So, you know, these were constantly looking at ways how to reduce, reduce, and we've tested some things out. So if you've been a customer for a while, you'll have seen some packaging, things change. And then we go back because, you know, we've realized it doesn't work for the product or it doesn't work for the ingredients. So things were always changing and evolving. So you'll see that if you're, you know, a consistent customer, which is, we're not just stagnant, we're always, we're always putting out really attainable, but challenging goals for ourselves.

Kyle:
Love that. Yeah. Love it. How much, I mean, going back to the beginning of the conversation beyond career, we talked about design is about storytelling. And in this scenario I know so much is unseen in terms of the innovation that's happening around sustainability. How, how much of a role does design play in helping, you know, bridge the gap as it were between the scene and the unseen with sustainability?

Bianca:
Oh, well we have, it's always one thing to, you know, we have all the assets we have, like we have like some amazing illustrations that, you know, explain the traditional supply chain versus a hello, fresh supply chain. We have a sustainability toolkit that's been developed by the global head office that we use in, in our, you know, marketing materials. But for, for the business, it always comes down to, and in terms of design is like communicating that at the right time. So we like, again, we always have to, in terms of design, we have to justify, justify and validate what we're doing. So sustainability is a huge push and don't get me wrong. We're always trying to communicate to our customers. The, you know, we are sustainable, we are doing these things. We are creating a better supply chain for, for, you know, fixing what this, this broken food system.

Bianca:
But at the top of mind is always convenience. So our design is always to, it always is to communicate convenience to our customers, with the sustainability added on. So a lot of our messaging is not, except I, I, I actually take that back. We just launched a campaign apologizing to the raccoons in Canada because our saw did you see it? Yes. Yeah. So, you know, we, we have, we have fun. Like we have fun storytelling campaigns that we do to, to, you know, kind of highlight this aspect of hello fresh, but the regular marketing materials are more of the con conven convenience focus. So I would say our bigger campaigns in terms of design are the ones that are driving these sort of additional pillars or additional benefits of being a customer at hello, fresh or the, you know, the feel good. Okay, I'm doing this thing. It's convenient for me. It's providing me delicious meals. Oh. And I'm also like contributing to a better, a better, you know, supply chain and I'm, you know, every box is carbon neutral. Like all these things that kind of make you feel good about the choices that you make.

Tom:
Yep. Feels good in your belly and in your heart.

Bianca:
Yes, exactly.

Tom:
You can use that if you want in your next creative pitch. That's the next, I think it's the next campaign. That's it? Yeah.

Bianca:
Me too. <Laugh>

Tom:
That's awesome. No, I it's just, it is truly inspiring. And, and I hope that those listening, you know, are, are aligned with that sort of approach and yeah, that, that this is just an underlying belief. It's a foundational practice, you know, that, that you take and that the, the brand takes, yes, it can have some communication around it, but, but really it's not about notoriety. It's not about, you know, gimmicks. This is, this is a true foundational pillar of your beliefs in how food should be and how business can improve on a systemic part of humanity. And, and I, yeah, I love that. So I'm, I'm so happy we've been able to, to cover that today. So I always, you know, well, we actually always like to ask this question with, with your time at hello, fresh what's, what's one of the more surprising things that you've seen or learned truthfully,

Bianca:
Like I've talked about this throughout this podcast so far, but it's truthfully the biggest, the biggest learning is how much you can really just learn about your customers through, through data. Like, especially when you're a direct to consumer brand, when you're a startup, like hello, fresh was considered a startup. It's not anymore, it's, you know, scaled globally, but you know, the data is what is, should be driving your decisions like intuition. Great. Like you think your consumers want certain things, but truthfully you have to, you have to validate that you have to validate that, or you're just sh you know, shooting in the dark. Right. So I think the vastness of like how well we understand our customers is like truly such an eye opening experience that I've gone through, especially with such a large global company with where everything we do is like, is that what the customer wants?

Bianca:
Yes or no. <Laugh> so one of the things that hello, fresh always communicates like internally is like, what is our DNA? And like, one of our big DNA pillars is like, you know, data drivenness. And like, that has really been, I don't know, I just feel like it's taken, designed to the next level. I know design is like, okay, is it on brand? Like, what is our story? You know, all that kind of stuff, but we can actually see when a certain type of, you know, I don't know, paid social motion ad is like performing really well. And then we can really kind of start to hone in to like, why, what is it about this that works really well? What are we doing very differently than we did last time? And then we have the opportunity to like sit back and really like dig into it.

Bianca:
Right. Because before it's like, you know, we are kind of, you know, making decisions that looks nice, it's on brand uses this pattern or this color or whatever this treatment that you know is part of our brand guidelines, but is it really like enticing our customers? Is it really speaking to them? Is it really like, you know, telling them a story that they understand and like, the data is really the sort of what allows us to say yes or no, because without that, we really don't know. So the data drivenness is really something that I find super fascinating because it allows us to really validate what we're doing, but also just continually to, to continually get better at serving our customers at the end of the day.

Kyle:
Love that. That's so good. There's so much to dig in there and unpack from the, the, the advice kit, but maybe we could round it up Bianca with a little bit of packaged up advice. I'm really trying hard on these parts. They're not, if you could just, you know, yeah. They're not too bad. If you could package up just, you know, some closing advice to D TOC brands to, to, to fearless founders and brand leaders out there that are in the D TOC space that are listening. What's, what's some advice that you'd have for them.

Bianca:
So my advice is it's, it's gonna package up what I've said, so good on you, Kyle, for

Kyle:
Saying that yeah. And make, can unpack it and then make it in 20 minutes or less and, and dance around with it. Yeah. Just

Tom:
A little good, a little bite, a little taste,

Bianca:
A little taste, listen to your CU. So there's a, a couple things I wanna say, listen to your customers and test. So test and learn and test, and like that's the, the language at hello, fresh test and learn everything we do at hello, fresh, both business related and internally is data driven. And we are consistently people focused. And when I say people focused, it's like internally, we're people focused and we're people focused for our customers. So everywhere we look, whether it be, you know, improving, you know, team collaboration internally to create better ideas for our new campaigns and storytelling initiatives, where people focused, we have actually internal metrics that we, you know, sort of track to see how people are feeling in terms of like how connected to their team they are. So I think like culture and people focused as a business will really, you know, allow a team to deliver to their, their customers really well as well, being people focused on the other end.

Bianca:
So I K I talked a lot about being people focused, like, you know, delivering to the customers, but a business and a culture within your, your startup or your direct consumer brand or whatever you may be is like, you need to be people focused. You need to have like people with growth mindset. You need to have people who are engaged and believe in what they're doing and are happy. And one of the biggest things for me at hell fresh was really feeling like, wow, like that it's such a positive culture. It's such a positive company. It's, you know, it's egoless in a way where like, people who have really, and, you know, an offside idea and they may be not a manager or they're an individual contributor to the business. Everybody has agency to bring ideas to the table, work collaboratively, all those great things.

Bianca:
So I would say like generally delicious, delicious, generally people focused is like, what I would say that defines hello, fresh. And like our brands specifically on both ends, whether internally or externally to our customers. Yeah. And like employ good people with growth mindset. It, you know, makes such a difference. Working with a team of people who just are excited and happy and, you know, enticed by what we're doing and in yes. And believe in the brand and believe, you know, what we're doing is good. Good work. So I'd say that's also a really big driver of a really good direct to consumer brand is really having like an internal people focused approach as well.

Tom:
I love that. So not only are you now offering low carb LowCal but also low ego

Bianca:
That's it's true. Oh my gosh. Yes.

Tom:
And high humanity. So you can keep that as well. That's another freebie.

Bianca:
<Laugh> it's it's

Kyle:
True. I feel like pillow fresh as a brand could pull it off. Yeah. I think that could be like the thing on the, on the selection.

Tom:
I'll be, that was such a beautiful way to, to wrap stuff out. Like I know we, we could not agree more agree more with, with those pieces. So before we say goodbye, fresh, I, I just wanted to ask what, what might be, and this is up for debate, but it might be the most important question of our time together today. So if, if you're ready for that

Tom:
Oh, okay. I

Bianca:
I'm I'm stressed. No, just kidding. Go ahead. Well,

Tom:
Well strap in, if you have a seatbelt on your desk chair, here it is. What is your favorite food slash hello? Fresh meal.

Kyle:
Where's the hang up sound effect. You've done.

Tom:
Hello? Hello.

Bianca:
Okay. So before hello, fresh. I was, I like, I love tacos, so, but I would never go and like buy all the ingredients to make tacos because I found it. I don't know. I find it labor intensive. I was like, okay, I gotta buy the tortillas. I gotta buy like this ingredient. Like, depending on like I am, if there's tacos and like I B I order all the tacos. So there's some weeks I'm like,

Tom:
That's why I can't get them.

Bianca:
Well, probably like, cause you ordered them one.

Tom:
Okay.

Bianca:
So I don't have a favorite meal. I would say any taco that is offered is in my order for that week. That's I just, yeah, I'm a huge taco fan. And before hello, fresh. I just always avoided making them cuz I felt like they were a lot to plan and I was just, I I'm a lazy yeah. Grocery shopper planner food person. So hello. Fresh is definitely a product for me. <Laugh> so yeah. That's my, any of the tacos are delicious. Yeah. They're my favorite. I they're always in

Tom:
My I'm so glad you're you're comfortable enough to talk about that with us. <Laugh>

Bianca:
Yep.

Tom:
Well, that's

Kyle:
It. It's time to be, to go And we'll meet you later.

Tom:
That's cheesy.

Kyle:
It's just gonna pepper this in here. Let

Tom:
Us, let us call this to an end. Bianca. It was great to speak with you. Thank you so much for lending your, your insights and your perspective and your expertise. Yeah. It it's been truly a fresh chat for us and yeah, I really appreciate you joining us and commerce chefs.

Kyle:
Well, that's it for this episode of commerce chefs. Thanks for listening.

Tom:
We hope you enjoyed and learned a little more about the secret ingredients behind being a delicious D TOC brand.

Kyle:
But if you're looking for more, make sure to join the commerce chef's community. By following us on social at commerce chefs, ask us questions, send and requests. We want to hear from you. We're

Tom:
Currently cooking up the next episode of commerce chefs. So be sure to tune in on May 19th. Remember it's just as important to feed your ears as your mouth because as they say, the ears are the other mouth of the head.

Kyle:
Lastly, if you like this episode and want to support us, make sure to hit that subscribe button and leave us a five star rating and review until next time. This has been a pinch of

Tom:
Kyle and a dash of Tom. We'll be cooking with you in two weeks.